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9:31 am
Just started checking out prepaid cell phones and it seems to me that Petro Can is offering a much better deal, especially since the Speakout rates went up.
Am I missing something here?
11:52 am
SO expiry date is 12 months for any refill vs. 6 months PetroCan for anything less than $100 refill.
SO's $75 and $100 refills rate is the same as PetroCan, 20 cents a minute.
11:58 am
March 31, 2007
Offline
Although I have lost a lot of confidence in Speak Out due to the way they delivered the rate hike, it still has a few benefits compared to Petro Canada, depending on your situation:
- Location. Some people are closer to 7-Elevens, some are closer to Petro Canadas
- "Effective" 20 cents per minute local rate still exists for $75 and $100 vouchers
- 365 day expiry on all vouchers
- Promotions. The "free phone with $100 airtime purchase" that currently goes until the end of this month is a perennial favourite
Petro Canada currently wins for:
- Location: this depends on the person.
- 20 cents per minute rate for all vouchers
- Lower long distance rate: 7-Eleven's lowest is 36 cents (regular is 45 cents) compared to 30 cents for Petro Canada
- Perhaps phones if you're looking for a particular phone
Have I missed anything?
4:24 pm
for PC
you can use Petro Points to purchase refills or phones
4:30 pm
That's pretty much it. I can only think of a couple of really minor things.
- With SO phones the phone is already active. With PetroCan you have to call in and get a number.
- If you get a SO $75 or $100 top-up card, the 'effective' monthly 911 charge is $.80 compared to $.99 for PetroCan
- If you want a Nokia 5200 (which seems pretty popular here) you can only get it from SO. Conversely, the Nokia 2630 is only available at PetroCanada.
- PetroCan seems to get new models in a little faster than SO
5:21 am
Big Ang said:
- If you get a SO $75 or $100 top-up card, the 'effective' monthly 911 charge is $.80 compared to $.99 for PetroCan
How do you get to this conclusion? Can you explain, please?
5:24 am
The $5, which are included in a new phone, has to be activated in 90 days also? I mean: do I have to make my first call to activate the phone within 90 days?
4:53 pm
timon said:
Big Ang said:
- If you get a SO $75 or $100 top-up card, the 'effective' monthly 911 charge is $.80 compared to $.99 for PetroCan
How do you get to this conclusion? Can you explain, please?
It's just another "Effective Rate" calculation. Instead of figuring out how to give us .20/min for $75/$100 vouchers instead of the now-normal .25/min, they just give us 20% more time (.25/.20=1.25) with the big vouchers. $75 becomes $93.75 when you load it into your phone. So, logically (according to Big Ang) .99/1.25=.792 (rounded up to .80).
7:18 pm
Thanks. It's a really minor thing, I was debating even adding it, but I guessed that Peter wanted to make a definitive chart outlining the differences. But at least it shows that the crazy new Speakout math does work in our favour sometimes.
2:55 am
Gopher Guts said:
It's just another "Effective Rate" calculation. Instead of figuring out how to give us .20/min for $75/$100 vouchers instead of the now-normal .25/min, they just give us 20% more time (.25/.20=1.25) with the big vouchers. $75 becomes $93.75 when you load it into your phone. So, logically (according to Big Ang) .99/1.25=.792 (rounded up to .80).
Actually they give us 25% more time (x1.25) but this will only make up for the air time, we still pay 0.99 every month for 911 access. We just get the same 500 min. for the $100 voucher as before... according to my logic 😉
11:04 am
March 31, 2007
Offline
Big Ang said:
Thanks. It's a really minor thing, I was debating even adding it, but I guessed that Peter wanted to make a definitive chart outlining the differences. But at least it shows that the crazy new Speakout math does work in our favour sometimes.
Good point. I'll update the chart on the FAQ with the 911 fee.
1:56 am
they just give us 20% more time (.25/.20=1.25)
Actually they give us 25% more time (x1.25)
You sure it's 25? Let me check...
1 + 1 = 2
2 + 2 = 5
5 + 5 = 17
17 + 17 = 134 7/8...
Yeah, I guess you're right.
4:52 am
Peter said:
Good point. I'll update the chart on the FAQ with the 911 fee.
Peter, I still don't see it's true but... you're the boss!
The only money you save is the tax as 13% of $100 that you pay when buying the voucher is less than 13% of $125 that you should pay. That means you save $3.25 (16.25-13= 3.25)
0.99x12= 11.88-3.25= 8.63
8.63/12= 0.719 so you may say we pay 911 fee of 0.72c/month
11:10 am
timon,
You've taken a wrong turn there. Sales tax doesn't play a role in "Speakout math". Any price that is mentioned is before taxes.
For some reason it seems that Speakout can only charge its clients one rate for airtime, which is now $.25/min. Probably a shortcoming in their computer system - who knows (and who cares).
Since Speakout only wanted to charge this new rate to the clients that use their service very little (and therefore only buy $25 or $50 cards), they had to find a way to charge their higher usage clients (those that buy $75 and $100 cards) the lower rate. Since their computer system cannot handle 2 different rates, they had to find a work-around.
The work-around is that when yo buy a $100 card, your airtime gets credited $125, and then you are charged the REGULAR rate of $.25/min. Because of the 25% gross-up, your EFFECTIVE rate is $.20/min.
So, whenever you purchase $75 or $100 worth of airtime, the EFFECTIVE rate of airtime you are purchasing is $.20/min.
Because of the 25% gross-up, to find out the EFFECTIVE rate of all the regular charges, you need to divide by 1.25, or you can multiply the charge by 0.8. Whichever you prefer, whichever helps you understand this crazy Speakout system better.
So, to spell it out.
$.25 per min airtime divided by 1.25 = $.20/min
$.99 per month 911 fee divided by 1.25 = $.80/month
$.45 per min long distance divided by 1.25 = $.36/min
(I can't believe I wrote all this to explain a savings of 19cents per month....)
11:14 am
March 31, 2007
Offline
Hi timon, this is how I see it. First of all, forget about the tax. It's a bit different in different locations in Canada; it's done on a percentage basis; it doesn't get added to your account; and it's paid when you first purchase a voucher. So after we do our calculations, we'll add a "before tax" disclaimer.
Suppose you purchased only a $100 voucher. $100 has left your pocket.
You get $125 added to your account. If you never made any calls, $0.99 is deducted every month. You can do this for 126 months ($125 / $0.99), with a few cents left over.
You've only paid $100. So you've paid ($100 / 126 months) $0.79 cents per month, before tax.
To verify this with tax, in BC you've paid $112 (5% GST and 7% PST). $0.79 + tax = $0.88 per month for 911 fees. Assuming you never made any calls, $112 / $0.88 per month = 127 months (one month off due to rounding at each step).
So you can say that the effective rate is $0.79 before tax.
You can repeat this approach assuming you've only purchased airtime and arrive at those same airtime numbers in the chart.
11:18 am
March 31, 2007
Offline
Hehe, good timing! Well, now we have two explanations 😀
12:44 pm
timon said:
The $5, which are included in a new phone, has to be activated in 90 days also? I mean: do I have to make my first call to activate the phone within 90 days?
timon - forgot to say, I'd asked CS this just recently:
Could you clarify if the first call to activate must be made within 90 days of purchase - or will the $5 startup included then expire?
& they replied:
"Your phone and airtime is activated upon making your first call. As long as the phone is not used the $5.00 airtime will remain active"
=========================
So - if you want to buy now with the current promo, you can keep them until Xmas or whenever without losing any time.
3:08 pm
will the Speckout phone or Petro-Canada phone be able to used with Rogers or Fido network?
3:53 pm
Andrew,
You'll have to clarify your question. But this may answer whatever your question is.
When you buy a SpeakOut or PetroCan phone, you are a SpeakOut or PetroCan client, so you buy your airtime from them. Speakout and PetroCan piggyback off the Rogers GSM network (since it doesn't make sense for them to build their own cell towers, etc). So, wherever you have Rogers coverage (in Canada), you'll have SpeakOut and PetroCan coverage.
No, you cannot buy a Rogers top-up card to use with your Speakout plan, and you cannot buy a Speakout top-up card to use with your Rogers plan. And as far as I know you cannot buy a Speakout top-up card to use with your PetroCan plan and vice versa.
Since Speakout/PetroCan/Rogers/Fido use GSM, you can put whatever SIM card you want in your Speakout handset since the Speakout phone you buy is unlocked. You will have to buy this seperate SIM card from whatever company you want to deal with, as the Speakout phones only come with a Speakout SIM card.
As well, you can put your Speakout or PetroCan SIM card in whatever unlocked GSM phone you want (as long as it uses N.American frequencies 850/1900 MHz).
Note: You can also use your Speakout or PetroCan SIM card in a locked Rogers phone (since it will view it as a Rogers card), but you cannot use it in a locked Fido phone, unless you unlock the Fido phone.
This should answer whatever your question was.
